Hi all,
A little history first.
We had a case with CSB two years ago. We finally got the COurt to order CSB to return the kids immediately, and it was closed. Kids returned that same day.
Now, a neighbor wants to have an affair with My wife, and She has told Him no. He has been calling CSB every two weeks and they keep coming back out. Claims are, messy house, no food and no beds. Each child has Her own full sized bed, plenty of food, and clean house. However, I want this BS to end. I'm tired of the invasions of Our privacy. I need ideas on how to end this once and for all.
We can't afford an attorney, but am willing to face them down yet again. I just want them gone for good!
Mike and Steph.
Need some ideas on how to handle this situation
Moderators: family_man, LindaJM
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MikeandSteph
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:20 am
First off think about protecting your kids with a temp guardianship.
http://forum.fightcps.com/viewtopic.php?t=1103
This is a delicate thing to do and only you can decide.
Do you know for sure it is your neighbor?
If you do then others on here may be able to help you with the laws to that.
I am not sure I would say it was your neighbor calling. The reason I say this is because csb will use anything and make up anything to get your kids.
It may just be coincidental that csb came out about the time the neighbor did this. If you suspected a neighbor and said that to them they picked up on your cue and are using it as there excuse.
CPS, CSB are on the rise to get children. Just about every state is hiring new workers because they get more money that way.
You need to inform yourself more and read all of the posts on this forum so that you get an idea of what is happening currently with the government in regards to this.
You also need to understand your constitutional rights.
http://forum.fightcps.com/viewtopic.php?t=900
Read this for starters.
You do not have to let them in anymore. You do not have to answer their phone calls.
You need go protect them when they start back to school.
If you want info on that let us know.
http://forum.fightcps.com/viewtopic.php?t=1103
This is a delicate thing to do and only you can decide.
Do you know for sure it is your neighbor?
If you do then others on here may be able to help you with the laws to that.
I am not sure I would say it was your neighbor calling. The reason I say this is because csb will use anything and make up anything to get your kids.
It may just be coincidental that csb came out about the time the neighbor did this. If you suspected a neighbor and said that to them they picked up on your cue and are using it as there excuse.
CPS, CSB are on the rise to get children. Just about every state is hiring new workers because they get more money that way.
You need to inform yourself more and read all of the posts on this forum so that you get an idea of what is happening currently with the government in regards to this.
You also need to understand your constitutional rights.
http://forum.fightcps.com/viewtopic.php?t=900
Read this for starters.
You do not have to let them in anymore. You do not have to answer their phone calls.
You need go protect them when they start back to school.
If you want info on that let us know.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
I was so peeved by the fact that just anyone can call in and make a false report and BAM! you are guilty until proven innocent!
I was not going to believe that somebody just being vindictive could get away so easily with screwing up someone else's life. But, they can and they do.
Anyway, my first reaction was that I went straight to law enforcement (Sheriff dept. in my case, b/c I am in the county) and made a report that someone made a false accusation against me. Then, if it happens again by the same person I have a record of it. Granted, it didn't do me any good, and I don't know if it ever will, hopefully I won't have to find out. But I do think it's important to document everything, and that is one way to add to your documentation. And it might just get something done about it if it is happening over and over. People are not supposed to be allowed to get away with this. In my state it is a felony to make a false report of abuse. Well? why don't they prosecute, then??????
Good luck to you.
I was not going to believe that somebody just being vindictive could get away so easily with screwing up someone else's life. But, they can and they do.
Anyway, my first reaction was that I went straight to law enforcement (Sheriff dept. in my case, b/c I am in the county) and made a report that someone made a false accusation against me. Then, if it happens again by the same person I have a record of it. Granted, it didn't do me any good, and I don't know if it ever will, hopefully I won't have to find out. But I do think it's important to document everything, and that is one way to add to your documentation. And it might just get something done about it if it is happening over and over. People are not supposed to be allowed to get away with this. In my state it is a felony to make a false report of abuse. Well? why don't they prosecute, then??????
Good luck to you.
Because, anyone can hide behind the claim of "they did it in the best interest of the children". Its too easy.
I was telling a friend of mine in Norway about how CPS works here, and he could not believe that something like this could go on in the
"super power of the world".
I read somewhere once that Ireland was the only country in the world that requires you give your name when you call in cases of abuse, and if those allegations are found to be false, the reporter will be prosecuted. Not sure if its accurate or not, but if it is, it sure makes Ireland inviting right about now.
However, I follow cases that are made public by the court of appeals and I am finding more and more cases in the past 8 months or so where the court of Appeals overturns the TPR orders. I have also seen less and less of cases where CPS is using the court of appeals to TRY to get TPR after previously denied. From posts of success on the boards and what I have researched, I really want to think that perhaps, things are starting to change. Slow tiny baby step changes, but its a start. Lets just hope the trend continues and more changes can be implimented in the future.
Until then, I can only hope that this board stays here to continue the fight for parents and children.
I was telling a friend of mine in Norway about how CPS works here, and he could not believe that something like this could go on in the
"super power of the world".
I read somewhere once that Ireland was the only country in the world that requires you give your name when you call in cases of abuse, and if those allegations are found to be false, the reporter will be prosecuted. Not sure if its accurate or not, but if it is, it sure makes Ireland inviting right about now.
However, I follow cases that are made public by the court of appeals and I am finding more and more cases in the past 8 months or so where the court of Appeals overturns the TPR orders. I have also seen less and less of cases where CPS is using the court of appeals to TRY to get TPR after previously denied. From posts of success on the boards and what I have researched, I really want to think that perhaps, things are starting to change. Slow tiny baby step changes, but its a start. Lets just hope the trend continues and more changes can be implimented in the future.
Until then, I can only hope that this board stays here to continue the fight for parents and children.
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MikeandSteph
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:20 am
Well heres an update.
They came out a couple of days ago, two caseworkers. I suggested they bring something only available to them, and their own camera. I would then walk through taking pictures. I also, based on another thread on this board, had several cases to cite. Result is they are checking with their legal department to see if this can be done. I have nothing to hide, Just hate an invasion of My privacy, my childrens privacy, my wifes privacy.
I also made them aware, since I demanded to talk to the supervisor, that We, being tlow income, will need an attorney provided, which will delay things even more. And IF they were TRULY concerned, they would take the easiest and quickest option to verify the conditions of the apartment and stuff instead of delaying it for 3 to 4 months.
Bu listeningto what the supervisor said "I can't confirm who made the call." I found out that there are records and in Ohio it is illegal to make false claims, under ORC 2921.14. They have been made aware that once the claims have been proven false, We will be getting those records to file charges and that they had better make sure the records do no dissappear.
Result, "I'll have to talk to Our legal department to make sure You idea is ok to do." First time I ever heard them say they will have to talk to an attorney!lol.
I'm posting this so that maybe someone else can use these ideas. Will post as things continue.
In short, I have proven a willingness to work with them, so they cannot use that for the issuance of a court order. They have seen the kids and talked to them, so thats out to. They have had authorization to talk to the childrens doctor, so thats gone. What else do I need to cover to have them totally boxed in?
They came out a couple of days ago, two caseworkers. I suggested they bring something only available to them, and their own camera. I would then walk through taking pictures. I also, based on another thread on this board, had several cases to cite. Result is they are checking with their legal department to see if this can be done. I have nothing to hide, Just hate an invasion of My privacy, my childrens privacy, my wifes privacy.
I also made them aware, since I demanded to talk to the supervisor, that We, being tlow income, will need an attorney provided, which will delay things even more. And IF they were TRULY concerned, they would take the easiest and quickest option to verify the conditions of the apartment and stuff instead of delaying it for 3 to 4 months.
Bu listeningto what the supervisor said "I can't confirm who made the call." I found out that there are records and in Ohio it is illegal to make false claims, under ORC 2921.14. They have been made aware that once the claims have been proven false, We will be getting those records to file charges and that they had better make sure the records do no dissappear.
Result, "I'll have to talk to Our legal department to make sure You idea is ok to do." First time I ever heard them say they will have to talk to an attorney!lol.
I'm posting this so that maybe someone else can use these ideas. Will post as things continue.
In short, I have proven a willingness to work with them, so they cannot use that for the issuance of a court order. They have seen the kids and talked to them, so thats out to. They have had authorization to talk to the childrens doctor, so thats gone. What else do I need to cover to have them totally boxed in?
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Guest
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MikeandSteph
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:20 am
A further update here.
It appears that CSB is having a hard time with this case. We have shown a willingness to work with them, by signing a release of information for the Drs. office for the kids, offering to take pictures with THEIR camera and with something THEY had brought that would not be available to us. We then did some research, mostly through this site, but on Our own as well, and came up with a few cases. So on the phone with the intake supervisor, I deflected Her statements with the cases, and the offers, and She said She had to contact their legal department. So far, We had heard nothing....until today.
I had called to find out what was going on, and if they wished to take Me up on My offer. She did not answer the phone and I left a message. She called back while I was at work and let something stupid slip......." We're looking for justification from the Doctors, but they haven't gotten back to Us yet." Catch it? Justification.
They know they haven't got a leg to stand on, and are grasping for straws here. Any ideas as to how to tip them over?
Want them to see everything claimed is false, but on Our terms, not theirs. Maybe some sworn witness statements, notarized faxed in to them? Maybe some pictures with the daily newspaper showing the date? Something to push them backwards?
It appears that CSB is having a hard time with this case. We have shown a willingness to work with them, by signing a release of information for the Drs. office for the kids, offering to take pictures with THEIR camera and with something THEY had brought that would not be available to us. We then did some research, mostly through this site, but on Our own as well, and came up with a few cases. So on the phone with the intake supervisor, I deflected Her statements with the cases, and the offers, and She said She had to contact their legal department. So far, We had heard nothing....until today.
I had called to find out what was going on, and if they wished to take Me up on My offer. She did not answer the phone and I left a message. She called back while I was at work and let something stupid slip......." We're looking for justification from the Doctors, but they haven't gotten back to Us yet." Catch it? Justification.
They know they haven't got a leg to stand on, and are grasping for straws here. Any ideas as to how to tip them over?
Want them to see everything claimed is false, but on Our terms, not theirs. Maybe some sworn witness statements, notarized faxed in to them? Maybe some pictures with the daily newspaper showing the date? Something to push them backwards?
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Guest
One thing I think you should do if you haven't already is get a copy of your kids medical records for yourself. Call the dr.'s office and tell them you want a copy and they will get it ready for you and tell you when you can come pick it up. You don't have to explain anything to them, just ask for the copies. That way, if the caseworker tries to lie to you about what's in the records, you can say "I have a copy right here and don't see that."
Also, I posted earlier about filing a report with the Sheriff's office. I didn't have the name of the person who called in the report verified, I just knew who it was, and I told them the whole story about how I knew it was her and why she did it and they did file a case report for me. I sat down with an officer, and told him "a false abuse report was filed against me, and according to the pamphlet DCF gave me, I should file a report with the authorities so that's what I need to do". I know it probably wouldn't do me much good without the name verification, but I also reported to DCF that I had done this, so maybe it made them think twice about what they were dealing with.
I think the notarized statements are a good idea. It sounds like you are doing all the right things, and I hope this works out for you.
Also, I posted earlier about filing a report with the Sheriff's office. I didn't have the name of the person who called in the report verified, I just knew who it was, and I told them the whole story about how I knew it was her and why she did it and they did file a case report for me. I sat down with an officer, and told him "a false abuse report was filed against me, and according to the pamphlet DCF gave me, I should file a report with the authorities so that's what I need to do". I know it probably wouldn't do me much good without the name verification, but I also reported to DCF that I had done this, so maybe it made them think twice about what they were dealing with.
I think the notarized statements are a good idea. It sounds like you are doing all the right things, and I hope this works out for you.
You need to go through and correct anything the dr. has noted in those records that you know to be untrue.
We have gone through our records and noticed tons of mistakes. Put a notarized copy stating the corrections that need to be made. Spelling of names, meds they say they prescribed and did not...had that happen many times...
We have gone through our records and noticed tons of mistakes. Put a notarized copy stating the corrections that need to be made. Spelling of names, meds they say they prescribed and did not...had that happen many times...
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
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MikeandSteph
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:20 am
Update time. Finally received a call from CSB. Low and behold, after what Has transpired, they actually ASKED Me if I was still WILLING to allow them to bring a camera out and have Me take pics for them. Legal Department said that it was allowed....lol.
Reading between the lines, they know that they cannot get a warrant on the baseless grounds, therefore, if they want anything, they have to take what I give them....lol. Gonna love it when I file charges on the person who made the false claims.
Reading between the lines, they know that they cannot get a warrant on the baseless grounds, therefore, if they want anything, they have to take what I give them....lol. Gonna love it when I file charges on the person who made the false claims.
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Anonymous
I think you also can do a DEclaration of Facts as well
http://familyrightsassociation.com/bin/ ... _facts.htm
Print this off and have it read the way it should read,incert your name and the true statement.
You will have to re word some things but the others will help you fix it.
http://familyrightsassociation.com/bin/ ... _facts.htm
Print this off and have it read the way it should read,incert your name and the true statement.
You will have to re word some things but the others will help you fix it.
JamesStein wrote:MikeandSteph,
I will say this just be careful, Our children went to the same doctors all their life. Never had another doctor not even when we moved. The doctor still went to court and testified against us. Now I can prove he lied but the fact our lawyer did nothing make it more difficult and I will soon file a civil case on the doctors office.
So another suggestion call the doctors office yourself and see if you can get something in writing.
James
I hate to say this but even if your doctor tells the truth and says only good things about you, IT STILL MAY DO NO GOOD! My son's psychiatrist (of two years) testified IN COURT on our behalf and it didn't matter at all! CPS's own doctors statement proved there was no truth to their allegations.... AND STILL IT DIDN'T MATTER! Our attorney was all pumped up before the trial and was sure we'd get our son back based on our doctor's and hospital reports... NOTHING! The judge didn't take any of it into consideration. We're going to the court of appeals next to try to get him back. They are our only hope right now! These people are so crooked it isn't even funny!
Just be very careful. Don't trust them for a single second! They're pure evil!
Chaco
My thought for the day.........
CPS workers are like Slinkies
Not really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs.
CPS workers are like Slinkies
Not really good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs.
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Anonymous
Do NOT trust them at all.They try to get you to trust them,and will make promises to you while they have their fingers vrossed behind them.They will even tell you if you admit tio what they want you to and your kids will come home.NOT!!!!!
Be slick about it,have them write it out and if they say i can't well you know they are full of it.
Be slick about it,have them write it out and if they say i can't well you know they are full of it.
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MikeandSteph
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:20 am
Well, they came out, I took the pictures and everything. Then, I had them sign a paper stating there were no concerns...in front of a witness. Even had them sign for a copy of the homeschooling registration and all....lol. They are also aware that a charge of making false claims is getting filed with the Prosecuting Attorney Monday.
As to the nature of CSB, I am well aware of it. It took Us nearly 8 months to get them back the first time because they said Our oldest was FTT. After all that time in Foster care, She hadn't even gained 1 ounce, not one lousy ounce. The judge ordered them returned immediately.
As to today, they stood outside the door as I instructed them and I took pictures of all the supposed concerns. I will be receiving an official findings paper early next week as I requested and they agreed to. Never leave Yourself without witnesses, or evidence. Funny how much weight a voice recording of them stating no concerns and a video of them would carry in court, especially as they deny any concerns......
As to the nature of CSB, I am well aware of it. It took Us nearly 8 months to get them back the first time because they said Our oldest was FTT. After all that time in Foster care, She hadn't even gained 1 ounce, not one lousy ounce. The judge ordered them returned immediately.
As to today, they stood outside the door as I instructed them and I took pictures of all the supposed concerns. I will be receiving an official findings paper early next week as I requested and they agreed to. Never leave Yourself without witnesses, or evidence. Funny how much weight a voice recording of them stating no concerns and a video of them would carry in court, especially as they deny any concerns......
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Anonymous
Here in missouri we can tape record without them knowing,and they won't concent to a tape recording at all,they won't sign papers or anything,but little do they know i have all of the emails from the old case worker to me and my attorney has them all.And also the email about the 8 hour visists that was the step moms idea and thats how the GAL came up with the 8 hours on sat and sunday.I'm fileing reports with everybody.
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MikeandSteph
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:20 am
MikeandSteph,
Good luck, big time. But keep your radar up and eyes peeled. They ended unfounded on my case once, twice, three times, all false, all created out of nothing, in an attempt to mudsling and hope something sticks.
I went from supposed Medical Neglect, to a fake charge of Failure to Supervise and Protect, to a heinous and sick charge of sexual abuse of all 4 of my kids including my Son, domestic violence and grabbing daughter's boobs... and I thought it was really over on the first charge, because everything was proved unfounded with crystal clarity.
Caseworker calls her own hotline. Second one breaks into my house. After that is proven all a hoax and the fact they broke the law and got away with it, I was told it was again, over, as my proof, tenacity and fortitude won the day.
Well, lets just say the third one was the bomb shell.
Just saying, it's not over. They know you now. You're in their system. Look up expungement and follow through. Still find someone you COMPLETLEY can trust and do a Temp Guardianship. I did mine for six months incriments.
Cause they will be back. The more of a stinging defeat you give them, the louder the retribution.
Stay Tough.
The Tech
Good luck, big time. But keep your radar up and eyes peeled. They ended unfounded on my case once, twice, three times, all false, all created out of nothing, in an attempt to mudsling and hope something sticks.
I went from supposed Medical Neglect, to a fake charge of Failure to Supervise and Protect, to a heinous and sick charge of sexual abuse of all 4 of my kids including my Son, domestic violence and grabbing daughter's boobs... and I thought it was really over on the first charge, because everything was proved unfounded with crystal clarity.
Caseworker calls her own hotline. Second one breaks into my house. After that is proven all a hoax and the fact they broke the law and got away with it, I was told it was again, over, as my proof, tenacity and fortitude won the day.
Well, lets just say the third one was the bomb shell.
Just saying, it's not over. They know you now. You're in their system. Look up expungement and follow through. Still find someone you COMPLETLEY can trust and do a Temp Guardianship. I did mine for six months incriments.
Cause they will be back. The more of a stinging defeat you give them, the louder the retribution.
Stay Tough.
The Tech
"The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth becomes the greatest enemy of the State." —Dr. Joseph M. Goebbels, Hitler’s Propaganda Minister
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Anonymous
Give These Marxists Written Notice Not To Trespass
Dear Mike:
Serve written notice on these whackos that they are not allowed to trespass on your private property without a proper & legal warrant.
Next, file an official complaint against the Social Services whackos that keep coming to your door.
Do not let these scum bags in your house for any reason. Do not let them talk to your children for any reason. Do not talk to these whackos.
Tell them to get a warrant, or leave you alone.
Next; file a government tort claim against them (if that is required in your state). Then file suit against them in District Court, or file suit against them in Federal District Court under title 42; section 1983 (violation of Civil Rights).
Bob Fletcher
Serve written notice on these whackos that they are not allowed to trespass on your private property without a proper & legal warrant.
Next, file an official complaint against the Social Services whackos that keep coming to your door.
Do not let these scum bags in your house for any reason. Do not let them talk to your children for any reason. Do not talk to these whackos.
Tell them to get a warrant, or leave you alone.
Next; file a government tort claim against them (if that is required in your state). Then file suit against them in District Court, or file suit against them in Federal District Court under title 42; section 1983 (violation of Civil Rights).
Bob Fletcher
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