CPS interviewed both kids at school and now want to see home
Moderators: family_man, LindaJM
CPS interviewed both kids at school and now want to see home
First some background: my wife and I have been married 10+ yrs, live together, and have two sons (8th and 6th grade). No divorce/separation, no drug/alchohol abuse, clean home, etc. No previous dealings with CPS so this came as a shock.
A few days ago my oldest son mentioned he was removed from class and interviewed by a "social worker" while at school. Since the questions he reportedly asked seemed benign, I figured it was a student sampling of some sort.
The next day my wife was awoken by the doorbell ringing and two males peering in the window of the door (literally, hands shielding the light so they could see inside). She opened the door for them* and they said they were social workers but did not present ID. They wanted to come in for an interview, but since I was not at home and she was half-asleep she refused them entry.
Later that day I called CPS and spoke to one of the individuals who had come to the house. When I asked what the reason was he said there was a concern expressed to CPS. He would not say what the concern was or tell me who made the complaint. I asked if we were required by law to comply with the interview request. He said "Yes". I agreed to have the interview at our house in a couple of days.
Later that day I learned that my youngest was also interviewed by CPS earlier that week. He "remembered" being interviewed as he heard my wife and I discuss it.
Neither my wife or I were told about the kids being interviewed either before or after it happened. We only discovered it when our kids told us.
Afterwards, after doing some thinking and a *lot* of reading of these types of incidents on CPS elsewhere I realize that perhaps I should not have agreed to an interview so readily. I figured since we do nothing wrong (no abuse or neglect) that the situation would resolve itself and all would be well. Naive, perhaps.
So I guess at this point my questions are:
1) Should I engage the services of an attorney? Any idea of costs?
2) Should I cancel the interview with CPS altogether, or have an atorney present, or continue as planned w/o attorney and see where it goes?
3) Can I retract the agreement to an interview after the fact?
4) Is not telliing the parent who made the complaint or what it regards normal precedure?
Regardless, if the interview takes place I plan on audio tape recording the proceedings.
*) I know, I can't believe my wife opened the door for two males who were peering inside. I advised her to call 911 if it ever happens again.
A few days ago my oldest son mentioned he was removed from class and interviewed by a "social worker" while at school. Since the questions he reportedly asked seemed benign, I figured it was a student sampling of some sort.
The next day my wife was awoken by the doorbell ringing and two males peering in the window of the door (literally, hands shielding the light so they could see inside). She opened the door for them* and they said they were social workers but did not present ID. They wanted to come in for an interview, but since I was not at home and she was half-asleep she refused them entry.
Later that day I called CPS and spoke to one of the individuals who had come to the house. When I asked what the reason was he said there was a concern expressed to CPS. He would not say what the concern was or tell me who made the complaint. I asked if we were required by law to comply with the interview request. He said "Yes". I agreed to have the interview at our house in a couple of days.
Later that day I learned that my youngest was also interviewed by CPS earlier that week. He "remembered" being interviewed as he heard my wife and I discuss it.
Neither my wife or I were told about the kids being interviewed either before or after it happened. We only discovered it when our kids told us.
Afterwards, after doing some thinking and a *lot* of reading of these types of incidents on CPS elsewhere I realize that perhaps I should not have agreed to an interview so readily. I figured since we do nothing wrong (no abuse or neglect) that the situation would resolve itself and all would be well. Naive, perhaps.
So I guess at this point my questions are:
1) Should I engage the services of an attorney? Any idea of costs?
2) Should I cancel the interview with CPS altogether, or have an atorney present, or continue as planned w/o attorney and see where it goes?
3) Can I retract the agreement to an interview after the fact?
4) Is not telliing the parent who made the complaint or what it regards normal precedure?
Regardless, if the interview takes place I plan on audio tape recording the proceedings.
*) I know, I can't believe my wife opened the door for two males who were peering inside. I advised her to call 911 if it ever happens again.
Identical situation here. Same thing, married 12 years 3 boys, loving clean home, no abuse. Pick my 15 YO up from school and he says he got pulled out of class and questioned by social services, needless to say I was horrified.
Our 11 YO got questioned the next day and CPS also visited my home that day, they also questioned our 13 YO son with cerbral palsey. I let them in and spoke freely with them, my husband left work and also spoke with them. We were naive, never having our parenting questioned and not having anything to hide.
They, from what I was told, cannot tell you the source of the complaint due to confidentiality laws. But we were told the allegations. My 15 YO son who was questioned first was told the allegations and this is where we heard it first.
I was given great information here. Have a note written and signed for at school, kept in each child file. Stating no government agency is to speak with any of your children unless you are first contacted and given opportunity to be present or have attorney or other person designated by you to be present, they have to obey this.
I would have an attorney present, no idea of cost, some of these very helpful people on this site should have additional help for you.
Good luck to you, we are supposed to hear something in a few days, as the thirty day investigation period will be up, the waiting is awful!!! Hang in there.
Our 11 YO got questioned the next day and CPS also visited my home that day, they also questioned our 13 YO son with cerbral palsey. I let them in and spoke freely with them, my husband left work and also spoke with them. We were naive, never having our parenting questioned and not having anything to hide.
They, from what I was told, cannot tell you the source of the complaint due to confidentiality laws. But we were told the allegations. My 15 YO son who was questioned first was told the allegations and this is where we heard it first.
I was given great information here. Have a note written and signed for at school, kept in each child file. Stating no government agency is to speak with any of your children unless you are first contacted and given opportunity to be present or have attorney or other person designated by you to be present, they have to obey this.
I would have an attorney present, no idea of cost, some of these very helpful people on this site should have additional help for you.
Good luck to you, we are supposed to hear something in a few days, as the thirty day investigation period will be up, the waiting is awful!!! Hang in there.
JTK
Just normal procedure for CPS.
They will not disclose the identity of the reporter but should tell you what the allegations are.
Do as Momof3 recommended, put a notarized letter in each of your children's file at school.
Questions:
1. You do need an attorney, if for no other reason it sometimes makes CPS act more sensible and legally. Costs vary from state to state and from attorney to attorney. Ours was $1,500 to start and got much bigger. Different situation though, you may be able to get one to handle just the meeting you have agreed to for a couple hundred. Simply having an attorney does not remove your need to be informed. Read, read ,read the laws of your state and the policies and procedures of CPS in your state. Knowledge is power.
2. Everything you are told on here is simply someone's opinion we are not lawyers. Since I had agreed to the meeting I would have it, to prevent CPS from twisting the fact I cancelled into having something to hide. I would however be prepared. Do not sign anything. History has proven that "Nothing" is many times a good thing to do, and always a good thing to say. Quote from someone, don't remember who.
3. You can rescind your signature and/or agreement pretty much at your descreation.
4. As I said earlier, not telling the parent who is normal. It is generally the law not to tell. Not telling the allegation is illegal and a violation of your constitutional rights, it is however the way they normally operate. These are evil and misguided people, never trust them, they are not your friend.
Diffinitely audio tape every conversation with them. Keep detailed notes of every telephone call or conversation not recorded.
Good luck, hard fight. We will say a prayer for you and your family to be successful and left alone.
Just normal procedure for CPS.
They will not disclose the identity of the reporter but should tell you what the allegations are.
Do as Momof3 recommended, put a notarized letter in each of your children's file at school.
Questions:
1. You do need an attorney, if for no other reason it sometimes makes CPS act more sensible and legally. Costs vary from state to state and from attorney to attorney. Ours was $1,500 to start and got much bigger. Different situation though, you may be able to get one to handle just the meeting you have agreed to for a couple hundred. Simply having an attorney does not remove your need to be informed. Read, read ,read the laws of your state and the policies and procedures of CPS in your state. Knowledge is power.
2. Everything you are told on here is simply someone's opinion we are not lawyers. Since I had agreed to the meeting I would have it, to prevent CPS from twisting the fact I cancelled into having something to hide. I would however be prepared. Do not sign anything. History has proven that "Nothing" is many times a good thing to do, and always a good thing to say. Quote from someone, don't remember who.
3. You can rescind your signature and/or agreement pretty much at your descreation.
4. As I said earlier, not telling the parent who is normal. It is generally the law not to tell. Not telling the allegation is illegal and a violation of your constitutional rights, it is however the way they normally operate. These are evil and misguided people, never trust them, they are not your friend.
Diffinitely audio tape every conversation with them. Keep detailed notes of every telephone call or conversation not recorded.
Good luck, hard fight. We will say a prayer for you and your family to be successful and left alone.
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- Contact:
Remembering what Gary said, that we are not lawyers, I have some suggestions as to how you should proceed. First and foremost, you do have a right to cancel the interview. You also have the right to know the exact nature of the allegations against you, and you should have the names and titles of the CPS investigators. They're required by law to give you this information.
Whether to hire a lawyer is up to you. It doesn't sound like the allegations are very serious; a "concern" is legalese for "there's not enough information to proceed, but someone wanted to flag this because they were worried about it".
You don't have to allow them entry into your home without a warrant or court order. That's pretty clear, legally speaking. But you may find them asking more questions if you do refuse them entry, so if you choose that option, proceed with caution.
Check out the "legal research" section of these forums. There are a lot of good links and resources that several of our bloggers have worked very hard to find, including a paper by Christopher Klicka of the Homeschool Legal Defense Association on what to do if they're at your door (while it's written for homeschoolers, much of the information applies to anyone). The paper by Klicka can also be found on the HSLDA website at www.hslda.org
I hope we've helped.
Whether to hire a lawyer is up to you. It doesn't sound like the allegations are very serious; a "concern" is legalese for "there's not enough information to proceed, but someone wanted to flag this because they were worried about it".
You don't have to allow them entry into your home without a warrant or court order. That's pretty clear, legally speaking. But you may find them asking more questions if you do refuse them entry, so if you choose that option, proceed with caution.
Check out the "legal research" section of these forums. There are a lot of good links and resources that several of our bloggers have worked very hard to find, including a paper by Christopher Klicka of the Homeschool Legal Defense Association on what to do if they're at your door (while it's written for homeschoolers, much of the information applies to anyone). The paper by Klicka can also be found on the HSLDA website at www.hslda.org
I hope we've helped.
I asked if we were required by law to comply with the interview request. He said "Yes". I agreed to have the interview at our house in a couple of days.
The only state I know that says it is law, is the state of Texas and it was just passed there in the last few months.
They will lie, and lie, and lie, and lie to no end.
If you don't have a guardianship for your children already think about doing one. Read this very carefully and decide.
http://forum.fightcps.com/viewtopic.php?t=1103
Many parents have a guardianship made up in case parents become ill etc. so that they have the say who will take care of child/ren if they should die etc. So for this reason you should also consider this. It is a legal document and many judges recognize it, but there some judges will have the guardian investigated too.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
http://www.nbhsa.info/reversemiranda.htm
You need to put this in your children's school files and notarize them.
You need to put this in your children's school files and notarize them.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
- Frustrated
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- Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 11:15 am
- Location: Canada
- Contact:
I am from Canada, and I have similar experience. They are unplesant to have around. It would be advisable to have the interview than to refuse them of one, because they will think you have something to hide, and it will prolong the investigation. It would be better to have the Interview over and done with. So they can close the case faster. Be prepared and proceed with caution. Don't allow them to check around the house, One of the CPS Worker some where said that you have the right to limit them to one Room only and refuse the other Rooms. That is your Right. I would write down everything If I were you, have the note and pad ready with you. Just keep the Attorney on stand by, just in case, but you don't have to need them immediately. Tape record them. Be advisable to check under your States when it comes to tape recording laws, some require you to notify them you are taping, some other states don't. Be wary and pay ATTENTION to what they say. Don't be afraid to say "That is not true". But understand, do not talk and talk, and talk, they will use anything you say and twist them and lie and put in their reports. Talk very minimal at best. Yes and no should suffice. Don't react with anger, or surprised, just remain calm and don't show too many emotions. Just normal. Just be careful. They are tricky and sleuthing. They usually close the Case after 30 days, some can go up to 90 days. If you want it to be closed and unfounded, grant the interview to show you have nothing to hide, but BE CAREFUL.
Just tell them "Please write it down (The allegations) so I can confer with my Attorney". By LAW, they MUST tell you clearly what the allegations are, but not the origin of the complaint. You may have the idea who make the complaint once you hear the Allegations. (usually)
Gary Shaw is right, you need to read up the Manual, Policies of theirs, so you can quote them back that they are wrong, etc...etc...so they can know you already read the Manual and read up the Laws, the Consitution Rights, etc...etc....You must do this so you can quote to the Worker this: "if they want to search your premise, you can refuse, quote the Consitutional Right to Seziure and Search Law" and tell them they must obtain a Court Order or Search Warrant to do so. It would be a GOOD Idea if you had your Sons present during the Interview, so it shows that they are NOT afraid of you, to show PROOF that they are not in any imminent danger or risk of harm of abuse or neglect. I have my Kids around all the time and they see that they are not in any danger.
Good Luck and yes Knowledge and Widsom is power.
Just tell them "Please write it down (The allegations) so I can confer with my Attorney". By LAW, they MUST tell you clearly what the allegations are, but not the origin of the complaint. You may have the idea who make the complaint once you hear the Allegations. (usually)
Gary Shaw is right, you need to read up the Manual, Policies of theirs, so you can quote them back that they are wrong, etc...etc...so they can know you already read the Manual and read up the Laws, the Consitution Rights, etc...etc....You must do this so you can quote to the Worker this: "if they want to search your premise, you can refuse, quote the Consitutional Right to Seziure and Search Law" and tell them they must obtain a Court Order or Search Warrant to do so. It would be a GOOD Idea if you had your Sons present during the Interview, so it shows that they are NOT afraid of you, to show PROOF that they are not in any imminent danger or risk of harm of abuse or neglect. I have my Kids around all the time and they see that they are not in any danger.
Good Luck and yes Knowledge and Widsom is power.
It is easy to steal from poor people. But don't do it. And don't take advantage of those poor people in court. The Lord is on their side. He supports them and he will take things away from any person that takes from them.~ Proverbs 22:22
Just wanted to say thanks to everyone who replied with advice and support. We had the interview with the CPS fellow, and it was tape recorded by us. The man was very friendly and once he understood that the children are in a loving, healthy home I think he was prepared to close the case. We were very open with him. I did make sure to ask him if he had any concerns about health or well-being of the kids ("no") and if he was satisifed with everything ("yes"). Also, I chose not to have an attorney present since it was very early in the process.
We did sign one form that was pretty benign - that we agreed to continue caring for the children and continue to use appropriate discipline. He said no further meetings were required.
So despite the horror stories, not all CPS folks are bad. I think you have to stand your ground and demonstrate that you are good parent(s) and base the conversational tone to that of the interviewer's.
Thanks again everone for your help.
We did sign one form that was pretty benign - that we agreed to continue caring for the children and continue to use appropriate discipline. He said no further meetings were required.
So despite the horror stories, not all CPS folks are bad. I think you have to stand your ground and demonstrate that you are good parent(s) and base the conversational tone to that of the interviewer's.
Thanks again everone for your help.
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- Location: Long Island, New York
JTK wrote: We did sign one form that was pretty benign - that we agreed to continue caring for the children and continue to use appropriate discipline. He said no further meetings were required.
Not to get you upset, but if there was nothing wrong why did you have to sign anything?
The best way to deal with CPS when they first contact you is not to allow them into your house, to ask them to put whatever information they have for you in writing so you can discuss it with your attnt, and to tell them you'll get back in touch with them AFTER you confer with your attny.
BTW you do NOT have to comply with the interview request.
You do not have to let them into your house.
You don't have to do anything unless a court orders you to.
I hope this is over for you.
Best, Dan Sullivan
I am sorry to say it is not over for you. You just fell into their trap.
This is their neat and tidy way of being user friendly to get you to sign this statement. Years ago they were noted for being ruthless; had to change their image to be more friendly, but it is a false friendliness.
Our daughter did this and was as satisfied as you are right now only to have them come at her 2 1/2 years later and hit her without warning. This gives them an open door to start watching and snooping on you.
You now need to be more careful than you have been. Be sure and read this site and others to keep yourself informed and start protecting your children.
This caseworker may say he is fine, but you are now on their files and what is to prevent another caseworker from deciding that s/he is going to reopen it.
They may not come back today or tomorrow or this year, but they will be back.
This is their neat and tidy way of being user friendly to get you to sign this statement. Years ago they were noted for being ruthless; had to change their image to be more friendly, but it is a false friendliness.
Our daughter did this and was as satisfied as you are right now only to have them come at her 2 1/2 years later and hit her without warning. This gives them an open door to start watching and snooping on you.
You now need to be more careful than you have been. Be sure and read this site and others to keep yourself informed and start protecting your children.
This caseworker may say he is fine, but you are now on their files and what is to prevent another caseworker from deciding that s/he is going to reopen it.
They may not come back today or tomorrow or this year, but they will be back.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
In signing this agreement, did you get a copy? More than likely you did not and most of us have done this.
They are counting on the fact that you will not ask for a copy. It amazes me how we as parents and grandparents do not insist on this. Any other thing in life we insist on a copy of the contract. This is a contract and you should have been given a copy. What you signed was a binding contract with these people.
My daughter signed that she would continue to seek medical help for our granddaughter. If she would have had the copy of that signed agreement our case probably would have ended sooner. They did not have it in her files. Why? Because they then would have been accountable for their actions and she would have had proof she did what they asked her to do.
They are counting on the fact that you will not ask for a copy. It amazes me how we as parents and grandparents do not insist on this. Any other thing in life we insist on a copy of the contract. This is a contract and you should have been given a copy. What you signed was a binding contract with these people.
My daughter signed that she would continue to seek medical help for our granddaughter. If she would have had the copy of that signed agreement our case probably would have ended sooner. They did not have it in her files. Why? Because they then would have been accountable for their actions and she would have had proof she did what they asked her to do.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
I have a copy of the signed form (the original top sheet), and it was offered to me by the interviewer without my requesting it.
I do intent to follow up if I don't get the "case closed" letter after 30 days, and I will likely request the full report via the state open records policy (like federal FOIA). In fact the interviewer even mentioned it first.
Hopefully this is the end of it. I recognize that sometimes CPS tries to ensnare parents into the system, but I don't feel this is the case and I consider myself a fairly good reader of people.
I'll return to this thread and post if anything new develops.
I do intent to follow up if I don't get the "case closed" letter after 30 days, and I will likely request the full report via the state open records policy (like federal FOIA). In fact the interviewer even mentioned it first.
Hopefully this is the end of it. I recognize that sometimes CPS tries to ensnare parents into the system, but I don't feel this is the case and I consider myself a fairly good reader of people.
I'll return to this thread and post if anything new develops.
John T Kelly
The best to you in this regards.
You are the first person I know of that got a copy.
Just keep on your toes in the future and educate your kids about being interviewed or talking to anyone about family.
You are the first person I know of that got a copy.
Just keep on your toes in the future and educate your kids about being interviewed or talking to anyone about family.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
DO Not Trust These People .. Dont whatever you do be prepared at all times ... Now any little thing they will coma at you with it beleave me .. Read as much as you can and learn it .. Do not sign anything else at all ... Do not talk to them .. If they come back tell them to get a warrant .. That is after this ine is closed.. Please please reead and read .. Yuo say you can read people .. Well normally we can but these people are not normall at all .. They are thieves and liars and using our children for a profit .. Please be careful sedwards
Hazel McBride, a contemporary suicide researcher and psychotherapist ... "No government and no court should be allowed to take a child from a parent unless there is a very, very, very good reason," says Dr. McBride. "Because to have a child ripped from you, it's the same as a child dying. It's absolutely uncivilized, barbaric and devastating for any parent. It's not uncommon for these people to suffer depressive breakdowns."
www.spareourchildren.tk
www.spareourchildren.tk
- Frustrated
- Posts: 3916
- Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 11:15 am
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Oh no, you signed an agreement. Good Grief. That is never ending harrassement later on, they will be back rest assured. I have signed an agreement with them, they are saying by signing this you admitted guilt. They are still haunting me to this day. Case is not closed yet, after 7 months. The case opened on August 2005, and signed the agreement on Nov. and nothing happens in between, they keep delaying and delaying, then they would pop up with no announcement whatsover. I know for a fact they are trying to introduce another Service Plan Agreement for ANOTHER 6 months. Remember they can extend your agreement to ANOTHER 6 months, or a Year. THey can do whatever they want. They are slinky Snakes. THey were FRIENDLY, and acting so nice, then all of a sudden they just attacked. I have 5 years of experience with them and I already have 2 Service Plan Agreements with them. They kept on coming back, why???? Because ours are in the Files and it stuck. THat's why. You signed an agreement which means it stuck on their files so they can come back again and check up on you. You can bet on that. It is NEVER over with.
Don't you know what the allegations are? By signing this agreement, it means you are guilty of these allegations in their eyes. That is what it means and it also means you signed and waived your rights away to them so they can do whatever they want to do with you and your Family in the Future.
I sure hope your Case is closed, and closed, and really SHUT. But unlikely, because you signed the Agreement, which means they can come back anytime without announcement. They can pop up weekly, bi weekly, monthly, until 6 months did you know that? They will check up on you for SIX months! That is what the Agreement is for. They even can question your Children at School again without your knowledge in the future. You won't even know what will hit you and it will be the hardest. That is why they are SO Friendly, it is a trick to make Families fall for their trap to make you sign whatever they want you to do, and they just did. Just remember any one can call the Hotline again on you, did you even know who was the complaint who made the allegations to start out with? I would stay away from those complaints if I were you. Because they will call again to the Hotline, and CPS can open ANOTHER Case on you anytime.
All the Good luck to you, and I sure for your sake and your Family, it is really closed and shut really tight. But not with this Agreement, you won't. This Agreement is still good up to 6 months to a Year. They can check every week, bi weekly, monthly, up to 6 months or even a Year to your home. They will look into your Window again. I know these CPS very well, up to 30 yrs of experience, and I have 5 years of Cases with them, and I know what Agreements means. I will NEVER sign another Agreement, because it is mainly harrassement. It is NOT to HELP You, it is there to HARASS you. Every signature just releases their Funds to CPS.
What was the Agreement? Counselling? Therapy? Anger Management Course? Take Parenting Class? Those are SERVICES, you might have to pay for them. I would check to make sure you don't have to pay for these Services. Anything you tell in these Services can be used against you, and put in their Files for record keeping in the Future.
Don't you know what the allegations are? By signing this agreement, it means you are guilty of these allegations in their eyes. That is what it means and it also means you signed and waived your rights away to them so they can do whatever they want to do with you and your Family in the Future.
I sure hope your Case is closed, and closed, and really SHUT. But unlikely, because you signed the Agreement, which means they can come back anytime without announcement. They can pop up weekly, bi weekly, monthly, until 6 months did you know that? They will check up on you for SIX months! That is what the Agreement is for. They even can question your Children at School again without your knowledge in the future. You won't even know what will hit you and it will be the hardest. That is why they are SO Friendly, it is a trick to make Families fall for their trap to make you sign whatever they want you to do, and they just did. Just remember any one can call the Hotline again on you, did you even know who was the complaint who made the allegations to start out with? I would stay away from those complaints if I were you. Because they will call again to the Hotline, and CPS can open ANOTHER Case on you anytime.
All the Good luck to you, and I sure for your sake and your Family, it is really closed and shut really tight. But not with this Agreement, you won't. This Agreement is still good up to 6 months to a Year. They can check every week, bi weekly, monthly, up to 6 months or even a Year to your home. They will look into your Window again. I know these CPS very well, up to 30 yrs of experience, and I have 5 years of Cases with them, and I know what Agreements means. I will NEVER sign another Agreement, because it is mainly harrassement. It is NOT to HELP You, it is there to HARASS you. Every signature just releases their Funds to CPS.
What was the Agreement? Counselling? Therapy? Anger Management Course? Take Parenting Class? Those are SERVICES, you might have to pay for them. I would check to make sure you don't have to pay for these Services. Anything you tell in these Services can be used against you, and put in their Files for record keeping in the Future.
It is easy to steal from poor people. But don't do it. And don't take advantage of those poor people in court. The Lord is on their side. He supports them and he will take things away from any person that takes from them.~ Proverbs 22:22
Did they ever tell you the accusations against you??? I hope for your sake that you read every word carefully before signing. As I wrote before my case went the exact same way but we were never asked to sign anything, all states may be different, I am still learning all this. I hope that it is the end of it for you. Our thirty days is up tomorrow, I havnt heard a word, I will make sure to be on the phone requesting our paper closing the case, since they havnt been in touch as promised, they lie and are sneaky, do not trust them. They were very friendly when questioning us as well, but I could pick up that their questioning was very tricky and leading.
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- Location: Long Island, New York
JTK posted this on Feb 07.We did sign one form that was pretty benign - that we agreed to continue caring for the children and continue to use appropriate discipline. He said no further meetings were required.
I am not as optimistic as Dan.
1. Why would a parent have to sign to continue to care for their children?
2. Why would a parent have to sign to continue to use appropriate discipline?
They left themselves room for coming back into your lives. They did this with our daughter. The very things they had her sign for were the very things they used to entrap her two and half years later.
You slip up and don't follow through on a drs. appt. or cancel one etc. They can construe it as inappropriate care.
Your kids go to school with the slightest bruise; you over disciplined.
at this time is what they are saying. That does not mean it was closed."no further action was required".
I don't want to appear negative here, but this is your children's lives and you need to be aware of their deceptive terminology.
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This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
- Frustrated
- Posts: 3916
- Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 11:15 am
- Location: Canada
- Contact:
Notice that this person posted the case was opened approx. Feb. 7th, and came back March 2nd or something saying that the further action was not required. It is because the 30 days investigation is OVER. That the 30 days was done with, but it could very well be transferred to the other Case worker who will be taking over their Service Plan who he just happened to sign about Care and Discipline. He did not mention anywhere if the Case was closed or it was unfounded, or vertified???
Just this word "No further action was required?"
Sounds like they are coming back since they signed a Service Plan with them. they will come back to check with a surprise visit one day. I am fearful they will be back, that's all. I mean CPS was SUPPOSED to write a letter to them, saying that the Case is now closed, and unfounded. or founded? NO letter?
Now that is suspicious. Just a call? I hope he is saving a Letter some where that "No further action is required", because he might need this evidence later on.
Just this word "No further action was required?"
Sounds like they are coming back since they signed a Service Plan with them. they will come back to check with a surprise visit one day. I am fearful they will be back, that's all. I mean CPS was SUPPOSED to write a letter to them, saying that the Case is now closed, and unfounded. or founded? NO letter?
Now that is suspicious. Just a call? I hope he is saving a Letter some where that "No further action is required", because he might need this evidence later on.
It is easy to steal from poor people. But don't do it. And don't take advantage of those poor people in court. The Lord is on their side. He supports them and he will take things away from any person that takes from them.~ Proverbs 22:22
It was a letter -- I have not had contact with CPS by phone or in person since the interview. I believe that it is indeed closed in the CPS's eyes.
I should also note that any further attempts by CPS to "drag this out" will be met with fierce resistance. I consider the case to be closed, and unfounded, regardless of what CPS thinks. Also have pre-planned the following:
Children have been informed to not speak to any CPS agent. Further attempts to contact the children will result in a restraining order placed against the CPS officer(s) involved. In addition to possible investigations of my own on the CPS officer(s) involved. It's amazing what a Google search can turn up (and has already)....
Attempts to remove the children without permission from school or home will be considered kidnapping and if done without our presence will result in the state police and FBI being brought in. Attempts to enter home or remove children while in our presence - well lets just say that would result in action that a CPS agent will be ill-equipped to deal with. It would be treated as a home invasion, CPS credentials be damned.
'Nuff said.
I should also note that any further attempts by CPS to "drag this out" will be met with fierce resistance. I consider the case to be closed, and unfounded, regardless of what CPS thinks. Also have pre-planned the following:
Children have been informed to not speak to any CPS agent. Further attempts to contact the children will result in a restraining order placed against the CPS officer(s) involved. In addition to possible investigations of my own on the CPS officer(s) involved. It's amazing what a Google search can turn up (and has already)....
Attempts to remove the children without permission from school or home will be considered kidnapping and if done without our presence will result in the state police and FBI being brought in. Attempts to enter home or remove children while in our presence - well lets just say that would result in action that a CPS agent will be ill-equipped to deal with. It would be treated as a home invasion, CPS credentials be damned.
'Nuff said.
- DontBiteMyNose
- Posts: 312
- Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2004 4:00 pm
- Contact:
Dazee your link was to the cards the children should carry, not to the letter to file with the school...Here's the letter link:
http://www.geocities.com/whosyurmamma/schoolletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/whosyurmamma/schoolletter.html
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My advice is my opinion and not legal advice
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A bad lawyer is worse then no lawyer and bad advice is worse then no advice....
My advice is my opinion and not legal advice
*********************
A bad lawyer is worse then no lawyer and bad advice is worse then no advice....
Thanks for catching that error.
**********************************
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
This is not legal advice;hopefully wisdom
To put it in simple terms…when the authorities ARE the perpetrators and the perpetrators ARE the authorities, there is no earthly justice or recourse, at the end of the day (unless the American people wake up).
Therefore, those who have achieved the highest levels of power seek to ‘enjoy’ the most grievous and extreme injustices. For many of those in the highest circles of power, the greatest statement of power is to perpetrate the greatest possible injustice…the savage, brutal traumatization and abuse of an innocent child.
http://themurkynews.blogspot.com/ MattTwoFour
"Ultimately, the law is only as good as the judge" --- D.X. Yue, 2005, in "law, reason and judicial fraud"
http://www.parentalrightsandjustice.com/index.cgi?ctype=Page;site_id=1;objid=45;curloc=Site:1
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