Hi there everyone!! I had to get on here to express something and maybe get some advice in some things...hoping that someone can be of assistance. I can only hope. Yes alot of times I have gotten on here and recieved very little if any responses..on a couple of occasions I have recieved quite a bit of help. Yes I have posted quite a few times on here and if anyone would like an overview I guess look at past post.
Okay...I felt that it was important that I inquire on these things and see if anyone knows of a thing to do. Multiple questions of multiple concerns...and of course multiple different situations. So if anyone could help that would be great. First off I have come to realize that someone that was on my case in the beginning when the kids were still in foster care actually was NOT allowed to be there for ANY reason as she was fired. She from my understanding was discredited on the stand at someone else's hearing and that she WASNT supposed to be on the stand testifying on behalf of someone else. I dont know what to gather from this information but I would THINK that because of it that would mean that something should be able to be looked into.
Then of course (I was quite court illeterate) in the beginning and was also told that because the judge I had I went before was the same judge I had as a juvenile and was QUITE RUDE to her that she was NOT allowed to take my case and that I could bring that up. How in the world would I do that after all this time. I mean that would definately prove biasesness. They alot of times would bring up stuff in my court hearings that reflected on me being a juvenile...so she basically was trying to compare my life as a juvenile to my life as an adult. Can something be done about this now? Can I take proceedings and if so what and where would be the first place I would start? I also had miscellanious hearings yet I ALWAYS went before her..I was informed yet again that most judges only have SPECIFIC hearings that they take. And a friend that had a case exactly LIKE MINE went before a completely different judge. They told me that I didnt have a choice to change the judge cuz she was the only one that handled foster care stuff.
I also have an issue with a pending court proceeding with my youngest daughter. Her father got custody of her on Feb. 3rd, 2003 and of course he is married to this evil woman....no need to go any further then that. She tends to act the age of a two year old. She doesnt establish that her actions are going to impact my daughters life...my daughters father of course does not have the nerve nor does he want to have a confrontation ....therefore he WILL NOT stand up to her and tell her NO. So she on JULY 6th, 2005 went and filed for a TPR with an adoption to follow of my daughter. First she does not like my daughter..I know this yet I cant find FACTUAL proof to show that she doesnt like her. She has a friend here where I reside in va that backs her up and says that she is a good person and a good mother. DO I honestly think that you would talk crap about your best friend? NOPE!!! She filed all this and of course I contested it August 1st, 2005. Since then NOTHING has been said...other then the occasional email or IM from the stepmother requesting for information she wanted. One was a 10 page questionnaire for my daughter and when I asked what it was for she said medical testing...(what was the exact term she used)...oh it was genetic testing. When I go through these questions there is questions of me...my pregnancy..my birth with her...and of course I think okay that is okay that I answer these. I get further in and realize it is asking questions like my mother and fathers professions among other things..and my grandparents same information. I refused to fill out the paperwork so she said that she was going to inform the courts that I refused to fill out the paperwork. I had valuable reasons...it had confidential information on there...I have ONE living grandparent so I would feel that would be a breach of confidentiality of my deceased grandparents. I am not within rights to release that information...(Can they use that against me in court?)
Then I called the father for months after that initial filing and of course everytime I would contact them (most times via internet...therefore not knowing who I was speaking with) I was told there was NOTHING done and they knew about as much as I did. So finally I recently got married on July 1st, 2006 to the best man in the world and of course my youngest daughter's father recieved notice that I got married...they all of a sudden filed paperwork and I know have a pending court hearing on the 13th of November. I am scared as I have NO LAWYER to begin with. I have lost two kids already to the system (adopted out) in 2004/2005. And on top of that I have not paid support cuz up until recently I didnt have a job or money. I am currently pregnant which brings me to another question as well. And my husband is active duty navy and is overseas. So he DOES NOT want me to work. So what are the odds that the stepmother/father is going to win this TPR and recieve the right to adopt her? They reside in Oklahoma. Does anyone know the oklahoma law and stuff that I can use against them. I have tried to make every means necessary to make contact with this child but they (the stepmother mainly) wont allow me to. Or even the pics of my daughter. They wont let me see her...send me pics or even answer my phone calls when I call....tell me how she is doing and if I IM they will not tell me. Well her father will. DO I HAVE PROOF OF THIS??? DO I EVER???
The other issue is I am pregnant. They closed my case back in like Feb. 2005 when my two boys were adopted after a thousand and one appeals. And after all efforts to show that I was misjudged and lied on...and doing what I got to do...but I lost. The case started (for those of you that dont know or dont want to go back on the past posts) Sept. 4, 2002 and all appeals were done by Feb. 2005. So what are the odds that they WILL try to do something now. I am married..live in an apartment (not through state assistance) and have a great man in my life. Great in-laws...what are the chances.?? Can they even come after me?????
IF someone can get back with me all these issues it would be greatly appreciated. I know that alot of people probably do not read these messages from me cuz they are sooooo long and I am sorry. Just had some questions to ask and I am hoping that someone can help me. Mainly with the last two...I mean they are all important but the other two are actual active. The whether I decide to pursue something with the devious judge and the such is when I decide to do so. But right now the other issues are pertinent. THANKS!! sorry for such a long message and thanks once again for anyone that responds.
REALLY IMPORTANT PLEASE!!!!!!!
Moderators: family_man, LindaJM
REALLY IMPORTANT PLEASE!!!!!!!
*whoever said that there is a honest social worker.?...they are not all totally honest and just because they are workers does not make them invinceable nor 100% honest...**
(that is my quote)
(that is my quote)
Pebbles wrote:
Does this relate to the children that have already been adopted out? I am assuming this was in Virginia? Was the 'someone' a caseworker, or other professional? Which type of hearing was this?
If the children have already been adopted out, you hardly ever hear of anybody getting the children back because of improper procedures. You could consider filing a civil case, which would be in a different court than juvenile court, and ask for damages from emotional distress and mental anguish, or something like this. You don't hear of too many of these, either, because if it was easy, everybody on this forum would be doing it all the time.
The same with filing in federal court for 'civil deprivation of rights.' You either have to have an expensive lawyer and a good case, or file it yourself, which is quite a bit of work.
When you had the problem judge, at the time your lawyer may have been entitled to file a motion for the judge to "recuse" himself, but something like this would have to also be in a civil suit, like above, I imagine, since the case happened a while ago.
Pebbles stated:
Is the current TPR case in Oklahoma? Do you have visitation rights? Did your daughter move to Oklahoma from Virginia? Did their move interfere with your visitation rights? If a parent withholds visitation by moving to another state, then that is serious and there is something you can do.
Is the Nov. hearing in Oklahoma? If so, go to Oklahoma government website and call the 800 # for information, and explain everything, and keep asking until you get help. If they are wanting to terminate your parental rights, then I think you are entitled to a lawyer. If your other children have been permanently removed, then they may not have to give you services, but I think you can still have a lawyer at the TPR hearing.
Who ordered you to pay child support, Virginia? Was this in connection with social services intervention, or only though divorce and child custody proceedings? There are forms to appeal child support. They should not have ordered child support in the first place, if there was a goal of reunification and you are poor.
Since you are pregnant now, they could go after the new baby. In some states, they can do it very quickly, without even giving you a chance to let someone else adopt it or have guardianship over it, according to someone on this site. Since your husband is overseas, there are military rules on guardianship, which you both need to look into, and he and you should quickly have your in-laws or somebody to be the standby guardians or whatever, long before the baby is born.
Whatever problem you had before, that caused the older children to be taken, start obtaining your own services to prevent trouble, even if the previous allegations were false. Take drug tests, parenting classes, or whatever, from the public health and mental health clinic or somewhere, to have documentation to defend yourself. I know that some church ministers may be willing to go to court with you and testify on your behalf, if you demonstrate over a sufficient period of time that you trust God to protect you and guide you in parenting, and show that you are committed to a healthy lifestyle.
First off I have come to realize that someone that was on my case in the beginning when the kids were still in foster care actually was NOT allowed to be there for ANY reason as she was fired.
Does this relate to the children that have already been adopted out? I am assuming this was in Virginia? Was the 'someone' a caseworker, or other professional? Which type of hearing was this?
If the children have already been adopted out, you hardly ever hear of anybody getting the children back because of improper procedures. You could consider filing a civil case, which would be in a different court than juvenile court, and ask for damages from emotional distress and mental anguish, or something like this. You don't hear of too many of these, either, because if it was easy, everybody on this forum would be doing it all the time.
The same with filing in federal court for 'civil deprivation of rights.' You either have to have an expensive lawyer and a good case, or file it yourself, which is quite a bit of work.
When you had the problem judge, at the time your lawyer may have been entitled to file a motion for the judge to "recuse" himself, but something like this would have to also be in a civil suit, like above, I imagine, since the case happened a while ago.
Pebbles stated:
I also have an issue with a pending court proceeding with my youngest daughter.
Is the current TPR case in Oklahoma? Do you have visitation rights? Did your daughter move to Oklahoma from Virginia? Did their move interfere with your visitation rights? If a parent withholds visitation by moving to another state, then that is serious and there is something you can do.
Is the Nov. hearing in Oklahoma? If so, go to Oklahoma government website and call the 800 # for information, and explain everything, and keep asking until you get help. If they are wanting to terminate your parental rights, then I think you are entitled to a lawyer. If your other children have been permanently removed, then they may not have to give you services, but I think you can still have a lawyer at the TPR hearing.
Who ordered you to pay child support, Virginia? Was this in connection with social services intervention, or only though divorce and child custody proceedings? There are forms to appeal child support. They should not have ordered child support in the first place, if there was a goal of reunification and you are poor.
Since you are pregnant now, they could go after the new baby. In some states, they can do it very quickly, without even giving you a chance to let someone else adopt it or have guardianship over it, according to someone on this site. Since your husband is overseas, there are military rules on guardianship, which you both need to look into, and he and you should quickly have your in-laws or somebody to be the standby guardians or whatever, long before the baby is born.
Whatever problem you had before, that caused the older children to be taken, start obtaining your own services to prevent trouble, even if the previous allegations were false. Take drug tests, parenting classes, or whatever, from the public health and mental health clinic or somewhere, to have documentation to defend yourself. I know that some church ministers may be willing to go to court with you and testify on your behalf, if you demonstrate over a sufficient period of time that you trust God to protect you and guide you in parenting, and show that you are committed to a healthy lifestyle.
Is the Nov. hearing in Oklahoma? If so, go to Oklahoma government website and call the 800 # for information, and explain everything, and keep asking until you get help. If they are wanting to terminate your parental rights, then I think you are entitled to a lawyer. If your other children have been permanently removed, then they may not have to give you services, but I think you can still have a lawyer at the TPR hearing.
Who ordered you to pay child support, Virginia? Was this in connection with social services intervention, or only though divorce and child custody proceedings? There are forms to appeal child support. They should not have ordered child support in the first place, if there was a goal of reunification and you are poor.
Yes the November hearing is in Oklahoma..and I have no idea how to get to the government website so if you could help me. I was sent paperwork that said that I was able to have a lawyer present but they will not appoint me one and of course I tried to legal aide there to do and they said they would not take my case...they didnt have enough attorneies....as they say. This is a TPR hearing based off of my ex's wife stating she feels it would be best for my daughter to be adopted by her cuz she is her mother. Regardless of what she thinks and how she is..I dont believe that...it is NOT like they have ever given me that chance to have a part in her life.
At the time they ordered me to pay support I was actually living in an income based housing area..had a job but barely over minimum wage and was already paying for three other cases...one of which was hers from DSS. No her fathers wife actually filed for this and even now when she speaks to me online (which is very seldom) she is constantly throwing in my face how dumb I am (which I am not) and how they are not going to be too kind to me since I have not paid support. I asked her if she was aware of the fact that I had not paid cuz I had asked more then once for a review. She of course continued to go to the money thing. That seems to be all that she is worried about is the money. So I dont know what is going to happen. But no the support as well as the TPR and the ADOPTION were all filed by my ex's demented wife. Can I ask the judge that prior to this woman trying to proceed with a TPR that she have psychiatric evaluations done.??
*whoever said that there is a honest social worker.?...they are not all totally honest and just because they are workers does not make them invinceable nor 100% honest...**
(that is my quote)
(that is my quote)
Please explain more about this person you
say was discredited so badly that they
should NOT have been testifying in your case.
What was their job?
What did they assert in your family's case?
How were tehy discredited so bad?
Did they suffer any punitive action?
(Like losing their license, court orders re testimony?)
When did you discover their problem and how?
You'll need something HUGE to undo a "done deal".
If you don't bring up issues during hearings,
you can't bring them up on appeal.
There might be an exception for when you
DISCOVER something HUGE but even then it
would probably have to be within some kind of
time limit (probably short).
This is a situation where it would take
huge amounts of money for a hired LAWYER
if you could find one willing to take it who
isn't just out to rip you off for the money
and do things with no chance of winning.
I am NOT an attorney.
say was discredited so badly that they
should NOT have been testifying in your case.
What was their job?
What did they assert in your family's case?
How were tehy discredited so bad?
Did they suffer any punitive action?
(Like losing their license, court orders re testimony?)
When did you discover their problem and how?
You'll need something HUGE to undo a "done deal".
If you don't bring up issues during hearings,
you can't bring them up on appeal.
There might be an exception for when you
DISCOVER something HUGE but even then it
would probably have to be within some kind of
time limit (probably short).
This is a situation where it would take
huge amounts of money for a hired LAWYER
if you could find one willing to take it who
isn't just out to rip you off for the money
and do things with no chance of winning.
I am NOT an attorney.
To do a web search for a state government, you just search for
Oklahoma + government
I did a search for termination of parental rights on the government website.
340:75-1-23. Termination of parental rights
http://www.okdhs.org/library/policy/oac ... 023000.htm
Here is the link to programs and services
http://www.okdhs.org/programsandservices/
Here is the contact page
http://www.okdhs.org/contactus/
Near the top, click the link for "telephone." This gives the main switchboard #. Call them and ask who you should talk to. I am not sure who you should contact, because your situation is rather complicated, so you have to ask them directly, so you will have accurate information.
Oklahoma + government
I did a search for termination of parental rights on the government website.
340:75-1-23. Termination of parental rights
http://www.okdhs.org/library/policy/oac ... 023000.htm
Here is the link to programs and services
http://www.okdhs.org/programsandservices/
Here is the contact page
http://www.okdhs.org/contactus/
Near the top, click the link for "telephone." This gives the main switchboard #. Call them and ask who you should talk to. I am not sure who you should contact, because your situation is rather complicated, so you have to ask them directly, so you will have accurate information.
Greegor wrote:Please explain more about this person you
say was discredited so badly that they
should NOT have been testifying in your case.
What was their job?
What did they assert in your family's case?
How were tehy discredited so bad?
Did they suffer any punitive action?
(Like losing their license, court orders re testimony?)
When did you discover their problem and how?
What is there to explain about this person other then she worked for the agency for 30 years and seems to be all chummy with EVERYONE on my case. Recently I found out that she wasnt even supposed to be there. She was given the oppurtunity to resign/quit or be fired. So my understanding she opted for the actual quitting.
I was also told that they were discredited on the stand and that her credibility was no longer good in the courts. I know that she happened to still be a part of my hearings. And my ex's wife still calls her to bail her out of things. I know that cuz she is still pulling strings. Some stuff went down yesterday that I have still yet to resolve as to why I havent been on here to respond. But yes she was a lady in the CPS unit for field consultant/program leader...a program to help the parents reach the goal of reunification.
How did I find out their situation...well because the person who got her fired is the one that is telling me those things and only did I discover these things recently. This woman had a lot to do with my case. I was supposed to be in a program her to achieve some things to prove that my kids were alright with me...(this was prior to them being placed) ...she said I made no movement in so many months..if I had the order right here in front of me I could tell you the details of that report...BUT I dont so I dont remember how long she said she worked with me...I do know that she didnt..I was not court ordered to work with her til July 1st, 2004 and I didnt sign a contract with her til July 16 or July 18th, 2004. I have all this documented but I am trying to think it up at the top of my head right now. The kids were placed September 4th, 2004. That was no closer to the time frame in which she stated. Then it happened to be that she was pulling confidential juvenile files and the such..there is no end..I could go ON AND ON AND ON with this woman but I wont.
*whoever said that there is a honest social worker.?...they are not all totally honest and just because they are workers does not make them invinceable nor 100% honest...**
(that is my quote)
(that is my quote)
Pebbles:
Why are you reacting so defensively?
Learning how this worker was discredited
would OF COURSE be valuable to most people
in FIGHTCPS!
We'd all love to discredit the agency nitwits
so bad that their own courts reject them.
Did that happen?
This person you described works in the
"CPS unit for field consultant/program leader".
How is it they "shouldn't have been there"?
You said this person was pulling records etcetera.
Why would a person with that job not be allowed to?
( I have noticed reports that agencies actually
do have "consultants" working with them not
so much to help families but to advise them
strategically how to drag things out,
have their way, avoid law suits, etc.. )
What you have run into is one of their "top guns"
who pulls a lot of strings.
We have identified one of those in my
family's case ONLY through cross examination in court.
(Handy to have the name for the Civil Rights law suit.)
It's as if they have a "damage control" person
who knows all the rotten tricks they can get
away with legally, every angle.
These "consultants" may be contractors who are
NOT employees, partly so they can be highly paid,
but if they can arrange to pay them enough
as employees they may be straight employees.
The direct contact between an opponent and
this person is indeed sleazy but is just
not enough to base a law suit on.
Aside from your contact, WHO says this
person is not supposed to be involved?
A Judge?
What's the basis?
That would of course matter as far as helping you.
Is there anything in what you found out
that can be made useful for others?
You're trying to undo a successful TPR that was done when?
You know that would be extremely hard to do right?
pebbles04 wrote
What is there to explain about this person other then she worked for the agency for 30 years and seems to be all chummy with EVERYONE on my case. Recently I found out that she wasnt even supposed to be there. She was given the oppurtunity to resign/quit or be fired. So my understanding she opted for the actual quitting.
I was also told that they were discredited on the stand and that her credibility was no longer good in the courts. I know that she happened to still be a part of my hearings. And my ex's wife still calls her to bail her out of things. I know that cuz she is still pulling strings. Some stuff went down yesterday that I have still yet to resolve as to why I havent been on here to respond. But yes she was a lady in the CPS unit for field consultant/program leader...a program to help the parents reach the goal of reunification.
How did I find out their situation...well because the person who got her fired is the one that is telling me those things and only did I discover these things recently. This woman had a lot to do with my case. I was supposed to be in a program her to achieve some things to prove that my kids were alright with me...(this was prior to them being placed) ...she said I made no movement in so many months..if I had the order right here in front of me I could tell you the details of that report...BUT I dont so I dont remember how long she said she worked with me...I do know that she didnt..I was not court ordered to work with her til July 1st, 2004 and I didnt sign a contract with her til July 16 or July 18th, 2004. I have all this documented but I am trying to think it up at the top of my head right now. The kids were placed September 4th, 2004. That was no closer to the time frame in which she stated. Then it happened to be that she was pulling confidential juvenile files and the such..there is no end..I could go ON AND ON AND ON with this woman but I wont.
Why are you reacting so defensively?
Learning how this worker was discredited
would OF COURSE be valuable to most people
in FIGHTCPS!
We'd all love to discredit the agency nitwits
so bad that their own courts reject them.
Did that happen?
This person you described works in the
"CPS unit for field consultant/program leader".
How is it they "shouldn't have been there"?
You said this person was pulling records etcetera.
Why would a person with that job not be allowed to?
( I have noticed reports that agencies actually
do have "consultants" working with them not
so much to help families but to advise them
strategically how to drag things out,
have their way, avoid law suits, etc.. )
What you have run into is one of their "top guns"
who pulls a lot of strings.
We have identified one of those in my
family's case ONLY through cross examination in court.
(Handy to have the name for the Civil Rights law suit.)
It's as if they have a "damage control" person
who knows all the rotten tricks they can get
away with legally, every angle.
These "consultants" may be contractors who are
NOT employees, partly so they can be highly paid,
but if they can arrange to pay them enough
as employees they may be straight employees.
The direct contact between an opponent and
this person is indeed sleazy but is just
not enough to base a law suit on.
Aside from your contact, WHO says this
person is not supposed to be involved?
A Judge?
What's the basis?
That would of course matter as far as helping you.
Is there anything in what you found out
that can be made useful for others?
You're trying to undo a successful TPR that was done when?
You know that would be extremely hard to do right?
pebbles04 wrote
What is there to explain about this person other then she worked for the agency for 30 years and seems to be all chummy with EVERYONE on my case. Recently I found out that she wasnt even supposed to be there. She was given the oppurtunity to resign/quit or be fired. So my understanding she opted for the actual quitting.
I was also told that they were discredited on the stand and that her credibility was no longer good in the courts. I know that she happened to still be a part of my hearings. And my ex's wife still calls her to bail her out of things. I know that cuz she is still pulling strings. Some stuff went down yesterday that I have still yet to resolve as to why I havent been on here to respond. But yes she was a lady in the CPS unit for field consultant/program leader...a program to help the parents reach the goal of reunification.
How did I find out their situation...well because the person who got her fired is the one that is telling me those things and only did I discover these things recently. This woman had a lot to do with my case. I was supposed to be in a program her to achieve some things to prove that my kids were alright with me...(this was prior to them being placed) ...she said I made no movement in so many months..if I had the order right here in front of me I could tell you the details of that report...BUT I dont so I dont remember how long she said she worked with me...I do know that she didnt..I was not court ordered to work with her til July 1st, 2004 and I didnt sign a contract with her til July 16 or July 18th, 2004. I have all this documented but I am trying to think it up at the top of my head right now. The kids were placed September 4th, 2004. That was no closer to the time frame in which she stated. Then it happened to be that she was pulling confidential juvenile files and the such..there is no end..I could go ON AND ON AND ON with this woman but I wont.
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