we are new to this and we need advice

[supermom10]

hello
me and my husband are in need of advice, we are new at this. this is my first child and his ninth and we never had to deal with CPS before. On Thursday Feb. 16 we had a metro cop knocking at our door asking about my son i asked him what this was all about he said that there was an anonymous tip saying that there was a child being left at home by their self and crying for 2 hrs straight, i then told the officer that my son is in his room asleep i even asked who put the tip in he told me that there was no name or number left. so after he left my husband called dispatch the lady said that the officer had nothing bad to say and it was all positive things that he put in his report, we even asked her for the name of the person that put the call in she said that there was no name that left. then on Friday Feb. 17th we had a CPS worker knocking at our door asking to see the child i asked her what this was about, she told me that there was a tip of a child being left alone at home by his self and crying for 2 hrs straight i then asked her who put the report in she said that there was no name or number left, so i let her see the child and she saw nothing wrong with the child i then let her in the house, (at this time i did not know that you not have to open your door, or even let them in to your house) so she then went through the report and my husband even told her that we had the right to face our accuser she said true but there was no name or number left. She then demanded us to do a drug test and marked "RANDOM" on both drug test sheets. we looked it up and there is no where it states that you have to do any type of drug test.The CPS worker even said that if we did not get the drug test done she would mark it positive. now what we need advice on is, with 3 people telling us that there is no name or phone number (casper) of our accuser how do we go about fighting this. the allegations are false and we have a federal program that is backing us up on this 100%. Please some one help with advice.

[Eljay]

They do not have to tell you who called in a referral, anonymous or not. I don't know what you're looking to "fight" at this poing... they got a false report, investigated and found it untrue, and they can close their case. If you really want to push it as a false report, then you can ask the police to investigate a false report which is a felony in some states (what state are you in?). IMHO, As long as this case is closed as unfounded, then let sleeping dogs lie. IF they come back wanting more involvement *OR* with a bogus positive drug test, then don't speak to CPS, come back here and look for next steps.

[supermom10]

our case is not closed, and we are in NV and my husband is worried about the safety of our 14 month old son and me. because of what we have read about people getting their kids taken away on bogus tips.

[Eljay]

Well... yours is pretty mild. There were no drug allegations? No beating allegations? Just left alone for a few hours? They should have no reason to drag this out as long as you refuted the claims.

[supermom10]

yes we did refute the claims, its just scary. never had contact with such an aggressive stance before

[monkette31]

You got to be very careful. It doesn't sound good and I'd have to agree with your husband. They left you paperwork saying that you have to appear somewhere and give a urine sample, this is not court ordered. As of right now, the nevada DCFS people are trying to strong arm you into services.

You'll pretty much never figure out or have anyone tell you who reported what, but I will tell you to absolutely NOT let that social worker in again and here's why. They have a report, whatever, investigate BUT in the course of their investigation they are INSTRUCTED TO INVESTIGATE BEYOND THE SCOPE of the allegation...so somebody reported bogus kid crying, end of story, but if you let them in, they will see and use anything they want as an excuse to strong arm you into services, messy home suddenly means you live in squalor and it goes on and on, they will use anything and they will even be nice to you in order to glean information to use to steal your child. They take the bits and pieces of information that ANYONE gives them and twist it up to detain your child.

GET A LAWYER AND REFER ALL CONVERSATIONS TO HIM/HER. when the social worker calls again. If she left you paperwork, SHE'S SETTING YOU UP to make a report that at minimum says that you refused to to UA (urinalysis). From this mere fact, she can insert anything she wants, such as your house was a pigsty, had the odor or marijuana or whatever, that you denied using drugs but you REFUSED to be tested. That right there will warrant the child's removal, which means minimum 6 months out of home. Tell her that you only want to help see the investigation closed.

Here is a great letter (they took out the real persons info) that was used but reading it may help you understand the point you are at and if they handed you one of those random ua papers, THEY ARE DEFINITELY SETTING YOU UP.

viewtopic.php?f=82&t=11828

Definitely read that letter, it seemed to work for a lady I know. Also, from now on, note day, time, call, notes with every conversation having to do with this. Try to write down what all has happened in the timeline as well. You MAY NEED this, utterly important. What usually happens is CPS goes about strong arming families into their services by slithering through the front door, acting helpful, imposing entry in order to report false allegations regarding home or whatever reason they use...and almost any reason will do, the more they see and the more YOU say, the more info they have to put in a report. It's kind of like a reverse of the "there's a veil of truth in every lie" situation, if they can insert any small detail of your life, ie, you tell them of your DUI 15 years ago, etc., suddenly you are a chronic alcoholic...

anyways, back to my point, after cps does this type of thing to families, the court lawyers and system then get a hold of the family as well...usually a few days after your children are ripped from you....and because of the trauma of the situation, these court appointed scum PUSH, LIE, INTIMIDATE and THREATEN families with termination of parental rights, etc (mention adoption etc much) UNLESS they go along with CPS plan of services, usually you and spouse in parenting classes, drug and alcohol tx, lots more, all the while you and spouse get to visit your infant one hour a week under supervision for at least 6 mos.....

This is NOT what you want, what is NOT told to families is that this initial court hearing where you've accepted their plans above, you have also waived your rights to TRIAL, to dispute any of the social workers allegations contained in her report. Later they will use this against you and say that you did NOT dispute any of the report at the time....right when they are ripping the carpet right out from under you at the TPR hearing....so, it is my belief that you must write down every interaction with these people, don't tell them anything else!, because when you exercise your right to trial, you will have the right to cross examine this very social worker....

99% of the time families get scared and intimidated into services rather than disputing any of these facts. Did you know that children's court is a FORM of civil court? Did you know that these social worker reports are taken in as FACT in this court? Do you have family members available to care for your child?

[monkette31]

I would have to say for today, if they contact you, try to stall them for now, tell them that you've been advised not to talk to them until you get an attorney, even tell them you have an appointment with one, reason being is would like to get you as far away as immediate removal timeline as possible, try to even sound naive or calm if possible to them. They seem to enjoy striking the unknowing and if you come at them with the I know my rights thing, it will piss them off, they hate people that express their rights. Save the expressions for court. Ask them if they'd be willing to have a meeting at their office in order to help close the case, tell them next week...

keep your child very safe on wednesdays, thursdays and fridays, their favorite striking time. When they detain a child, they like to do so before the weekend, because weekends don't count as far as the 72 hours until the hearing goes.

Make sure your child's medical file is up to date,that he/she has not missed any appointments, etc., they want your signature to access his/her files so they can look for "medical neglect" which ONE missed appointment is indicative of to them and would qualify them to allege medical neglect on you. There's also a lady somewhere around here who's son missed ONE day of school enrollment and they alleged and charged her with "educational neglect". That's the only reason they want records, to find fault in order to take child and your family into services. Sometimes, they just get away with the child still being left in the home, but the parents doing therapy and in home parent observations and such, it's still all services that they get paid for. If your child is special needs, they will go after them with a vengeance.

[monkette31]

Guaranteed, she is already setting you guys up. Why would she ask for an on Demand/Random drug test? In her report, it will be sure to have a reason, I mean you can't just demand a random test on everyone now could you? In her report, it will be sure to say she smelled or saw something drug/alcohol related, whether one empty beer can or whatever, if this snake thinks she can get you on this, she will....and she is.

Depending on how volatile this gets, if you catch it early enough, you may be able to keep the child in your home. Discussing a meeting AT THEIR OFFICE might give you a little more insight into what they want and how hard they want to go with you. It is usually the families that have offered up all the family history over coffee with the caseworker who have a lot to worry about and by then it is too late, the socialistic pig worker has got the vein of truth in her bs report. Maybe you guys can get ahead of them and just take family preventative services? I am not saying that any of this is right at all...I just understand how your situation can lead to the long term loss of life with your child and it does, your husband is right on that...if you don't get ahead of them as much as possible. It would be better to have your infant living with you and you take some parenting classes rather than them detaining your child (95% permanent for 6 mos minimum, usually it's a standard year...), enforce your child and your's separation and alienation............

[Eljay]

The CPS worker even said that if we did not get the drug test done she would mark it positive.

Oh dear... I just read this again and had a completely different perspective than the first time I read it. I read it as if she would mark her entire CASE/REPORT as "positive, as in nothing to be concerned with" but now I see she was saying she would FABRICATE EVIDENCE and mark your drug test as "positive for drugs"!!!! Ok, I hear the alarm bells now. Sorry!

If you haven't already, write down/transcribe your conversation with her while it is still fresh in your heads. If that is indeed what she said, then she basically said she would lie in order to force CPS into your lives. My advice would be to NOT take the test, but instead to write it all down in a letter. You can use this sample letter
http://forum.fightcps.com/viewtopic.php?f=82&t=11828
as a foundation, letting them know you consider the investigation unfounded, based on false allegations and tell them they can close it and send you written confirmation.

Make sure you indicate that you won't be bullied by an organization that threatens to fabricate evidence for their benefit. I would send it to the caseworker's supervisor, the director of the organization and the ombudsman. Don't let them bully you!

[supermom10]

now since the tip came in from anonymous person, can she legally get a warrant to come in and pick up the child? and also to clear up any miss understanding my husband is not the biological father of my son, but he takes him in as his own. i also put the link on my desktop of my computer to day i will print it out and sign it and fax it to her, also i have done an out line on what has happened on the 16th and 17th, and i also sent it over to my organization coordinator. me and my husband is trying to figure out where he can send me and my son, my husband and i don't have any close family that will help out. also she was demanding to see our prescription bottles we did not bring them out to let her see them.

[Eljay]

"can she LEGALLY get a warrant" ... well, the problem is that she CAN lie to the court and say whatever she wants to get a warrant. CPS people do it all the time. In fact, she already told you she WOULD lie to get what she wants. If she went to the court and said, "anonymous caller said child was left alone, crying for two hours and we want to take legal custody" no judge in his/her right mind would issue a warrant. She WILL have to lie to get a warrant, and they do it all the time.

You need to nip this in the bud. Call the police officer who came out for the first investigation and tell him what the caseworker told you about threatening to lie to take your child. Get this clear in your mind: THIS PERSON IS THREATENING TO ABDUCT YOUR CHILD UNDER THE COLOR OF LAW!!!! You need to file a RESTRAINING ORDER against the caseworker and have the police investigate the person for breaking the law. Fabrication of evidence is a crime. You are VERY, VERY fortunate that your case worker actually spoke those words to you!!!! You need to tell the police NOW and tell them what was said, tell them you want it investigated. Most case workers are not stupid enough to admit that they are lying, or planning to lie. This is a serious threat to your family!!!!!

If the caseworker shows up with a warrant, you will need to be able to call the police officer involved and stop them right then and there. Call the police. NOW!

[Eljay]

Just to comment on the other items here....

and also to clear up any miss understanding my husband is not the biological father of my son, but he takes him in as his own.

That should be totally immaterial. If there is no abuse or neglect going on, then it doesn't matter. Only if there is abuse or neglect does it matter that statistically he is more likely to abuse/neglect than bio-dad. Of course, moms are statistically more likely to abuse than dads/steps/boyfriends anyhow.

i also put the link on my desktop of my computer to day i will print it out and sign it and fax it to her

What does that mean? Link to what?

also i have done an out line on what has happened on the 16th and 17th, and i also sent it over to my organization coordinator.

What's an "organization coordinator" and what does that have to do with this issue?

me and my husband is trying to figure out where he can send me and my son, my husband and i don't have any close family that will help out.

How old is your child? Not school age, I hope.

[supermom10]

the link that was sent with the paper work that i need to send to the case worker. to start off we had to protect our son from his biological father in the first place he was abusive person and we had to go to shelters then we meet an organization that would help us out (my son, my husband, and me). my child is only 14 months. and he does not misbehave he is a very good child the only time he cries is when he needs food or a diaper change, other wise he stays to his self either watch t.v. or plays with his toys.

[Eljay]

I wouldn't send them any paperwork *IF* the only allegation on the table is that your child was left alone. They investigated, I assume you told them it was not true, and that's all the investigating they needed to do. On the other hand, if you've already talked to them and opened up a can of worms by admitting to current or former drug use, to having your child around/in an abusive situation, etc., then you *might* be at risk of them inflicting themselves upon you. However, I would *STILL* stand my ground with them given that they have threatened to lie regarding your drug test.

In an ideal world, they would have showed up at your door, asked about the allegations, you would have refuted them and told them to go on their way. If they asked you about ANYTHING else, you'd say, "that has nothing to do with the allegation that was called in" and ended it. CPS has the right to take over control of ABUSED OR NEGLECTED children. If you child was neither abused or neglected, then you need to tell them that they have no business to be involved in your lives.

If they get a call that a child was, oh, let's say burned with branding iron, they would have the right to come to your home (OUTSIDE) and tell you, "we got a call that your child was burned with a branding iron and we need to investigate." You'd bring your child to the door, let them do an exam and/or ask the child if he/she was branded. That's IT. Next, they would say that they "NEEDED" to check the house, inspect the fridge, get access to the child's medical records, have you do a drug test, etc. ... you would say, over and over again, "that has nothing to do with the allegation... you've investigated the allegation and you can now close your case." The problem is that people think, "well, we have nothing to hide" and they talk to them, answer all kinds of questions, sign releases, etc. CPS will take those answers and twist them up every which way you can imagine. Have a lively debate in the presence of your child? They will say that there is DOMESTIC VIOLENCE in the house. Child hasn't had a dental check-up for 8 months because you had to reschedule? They'll call that MEDICAL NEGLECT. There are so many sad, pathetic examples of how they manipulate and outright lie.

There are lots of different situations we hear about on this website. Sometimes the advice is to go ahead and work with them so that they can confirm that all is well and close their investigation. Sometimes the advice is to stop talking to them and get a lawyer. In your situation, because the caseworker has already told you that he/she *WILL LIE* if you don't comply, you are clearly dealing with the worst type. Do *NOT* talk to them any more, do *NOT* send them their forms, do *NOT* go get a drug test done. You need to call the police and use them to bolster your family's safety barrier. The police have nothing to gain by lying... CPS will make lots of money by putting your child in foster care. You need to make sure it's not YOUR child that they take.

[supermom10]

we are going to try and get a hold of the officer that did the investigating and go from there.

[Eljay]

From your initial post... what does this mean?

the allegations are false and we have a federal program that is backing us up on this 100%.

[supermom10]

Hey everyone this is Big Christian -- Cheryl's husband and Baby Christian's step father but I hope he only knows me as daddy for the simple fact that his father is let's just say a bad person.
Update, the federal program that is backing us is called Family Promise. They help families where at least one person is disabled and they have one child or more. Our program director is a wonderful person and I would love to mention her by name so she gets the proper kudos, but I can't. In a previous post by a different member it was said that CPS will use only negative information against the parents that are accused of neglecting and/or abusing their child(ren). This can not be more true. The police officers that came out the day before CPS came out put all positive things in their 'CAD' report (??? don't know exactly what that is, but was assured by LVMPD that it was an important part of an officer's investigation), and their closing was that there was nothing to substantiate the claims. Now, Las Vegas does things so weird. There are different courts and one of course is family court. My wife and I were going to file a restraining order against MARY JANE AT*****RY ( NOTE-- she is 40 years old makes 80K yearly and has worked for CPS since March of 2009, is not married, has no children and lives in North Las Vegas) according to mary jane, she marks all drug tests random, which I find is hard to believe, and as of today, as far as she is concerned, the allegations are unfounded and should be closing the case soon. One major thing to remember is NEVER LET YOUR GUARD DOWN. I am going to choose to fall back on our rights and if for some reason they want to come back, they will be met as aggressive intruders and handled as such. I will not let them put our family in a state of fear, or having us live like they are constantly lurking in the shadows. Until I get the papers saying that this case is closed, our guard is up,
If there is anyone in the Las Vegas or Clark County area that needs anything, feel free to contact us, my wife and I are willing to help if we are able to.

[Eljay]

It sounds like you have a great handle on this situation and are preparing well for any battle that may arise. Aren't you just shaking your head, thinking "what the heck?"

I had to edit out the name of the caseworker... I don't know the history behind the policy, but it's site policy. It won't be to your benefit in any way but could be bad for you (don't want a slander suit).

[supermom10]

Sorry about that, and yes, we are shaking our heads in complete disbelief because normal days do not include a person's home being violated and hearing a visitor demand this and demand that. If I may say though, our contact at Family Promise left several messages on the CPS workers phone and to this writing the worker never returned the calls. Goes back to the post where it was said that any information that may be positive for the parents will not be used. Once again, sorry about the name using.

[monkette31]

cps likes to black out any ADVOCATES for family. In my case, I had a wonderful friend as an advocate and their documentation was nothing but lies, no mention of it. They will probably not even mention that you have this program as an advocate and will tell no one. Be sure to write down the times you hear that the program has called the socialistic pig worker without a response. If it ever should get to trial, you can then bring this up.

[monkette31]

You know this caseworker is strong arming you. She is running around snatching people's children using powers that she does not have to do so! She cannot mark your test as positive if you do not take the test...she can only write that you refused....however after a court orders a series of u.a.'s, usually standard in any case having mention of alcohol/marijuana, etc., if you refuse test or can't pee or whatever, they do mark it as POSITIVE.....only after test has been court ordered....and the judge usually makes this very clear to parents. The problem with this is that you have some head hunting whack job of a dcfs investigator running around up there, most likely doing this consistently, violating people's rights INTENTIONALLY and lying and threatening them with a fraudulent act, intimidating them. This is straight out nazi effed up behavior. While she threatens her illegal and unprofessional act of marking your test positive, she slithers around your family, pumping for information that she can put in her report to steal your children.

You, at minimum should report her to the california behavioral science board, where they have the list of licensed social workers. You can look up her name to see if she is even licensed or if she is just some slimy snake with a bachelors being supervised by a licensed social worker.

That's great Christian, I hope they get out of your lives. When you say the social worker Mary Jane...marks all tests random, you might be misunderstanding the word random when it comes to dcfs and urinalysis testing. They call the demand for urinalysis RANDOM and sometimes they call it ON DEMAND. I think she is just referring to their system of marking it. She could have also used the words ON DEMAND, but these are just labels. I'm kind of pissed off today and this social worker is really bad to be doing what she is doing, intimidating families into government services by fraudulent means....oh, that is so bad...and they do it all the time, everywhere..... She probably does this to hundreds of families per year, please always let your experience with dcfs be known in order to help others when you can.

[supermom10]

Thank you for the post. To everyone here is an update of what is going on, MJ contacted our coordinator and told her that the case is still open and that she was just looking for the major drugs, but she told us that it's not just the major drugs she is looking into it is our prescriptions as well, she is strong arming us. Me and my husband has also talked to the person who put in the false tip and he admitted to us that he did put in a false DFS clam and it is because he wanted us to get kicked out of the program that we are involved in and our home, and for me to get stressed out and quit school. Why is it when things are going right other people get jealous and destroy the good things that other people have? When i have talked to MJ she made it sound like she was going to drop the case, but now it seems different, opposite. we also have found out that DFS field workers do not have to be licensed from state board. can you say OMG? so do we say we don't recognize her authority?

[Eljay]

Thank you for the post. To everyone here is an update of what is going on, MJ contacted our coordinator and told her that the case is still open and that she was just looking for the major drugs, but she told us that it's not just the major drugs she is looking into it is our prescriptions as well, she is strong arming us.

Why in the world are you talking to these people about drugs? Did you leave out that that was part of the original allegation? You just said it was because your son was left alone for two hours straight. If that is the ONLY allegation, that is ALL you should ever talk to them about. Don't give them any other reason to extend this case!!!!! Here's how it should go:

CW: I'm here to investigate a report we received at CPS regarding your child.
You (on your front porch): What is the allegation? Please speak slowly, I'm going to write this down in case my video recording fails.
CW: We received report that you chopped off your child's foot.
You: Are there any other allegations?
CW: No.
You: Here's my child's foot, as you can see it firmly attached to his LEG. [ edit ]
CW: Do you take drugs?
You: This has nothing to do with the allegations you are investigating. You have enough information to close your case.
CW: Are you employed or on public assistance?
You: This has nothing to do with the allegations you are investigating. You have enough information to close your case.
CW: Has your child missed any school this week?
You: This has nothing to do with the allegations you are investigating. You have enough information to close your case.
CW: We need to determine whether your child is healthy. When did he last see a dentist?
You: This has nothing to do with the allegations you are investigating. You have enough information to close your case.
CW: I need to see the home to see if it's clean.
You: This has nothing to do with the allegations you are investigating. You have enough information to close your case.
CW: If you don't tell me, I'll take you to court.
You: This has nothing to do with the allegations you are investigating. You have enough information to close your case.

Get the gist?

Me and my husband has also talked to the person who put in the false tip and he admitted to us that he did put in a false DFS clam and it is because he wanted us to get kicked out of the program that we are involved in and our home, and for me to get stressed out and quit school. Why is it when things are going right other people get jealous and destroy the good things that other people have? When i have talked to MJ she made it sound like she was going to drop the case, but now it seems different, opposite.

From your state: http://www.dcfs.state.nv.us/ChildFatalities/ChildProtServices/CPS_Required_Mandated_Reporting_Child_Abuse.pdf

A person who knowingly and willfully makes or causes another person to make a false report of
child abuse or neglect is guilty of a misdemeanor (NRS 432B.240)

So, write down what he said to you and go to the police. He committed a crime and confessed it to you. Maybe you should get him on tape first, since he's already admitted to being a liar.

we also have found out that DFS field workers do not have to be licensed from state board. can you say OMG? so do we say we don't recognize her authority?

CPS employs people to be caseworkers, investigators, emergency responders, etc. so you're not really going to get them to go away with that line of reasoning. You're going to get them to go away because they only have authority over abuse or neglected children. If you did not abuse or neglect your child, then they have no business in your life. They have the authority to INVESTIGATE the ALLEGATIONS, and until they determine that your child is abused or neglected, that is the only authority they have.

[Daruma]

You (on your front porch): What is the allegation? Please speak slowly, I'm going to write this down in case my video recording fails.
CW: We received report that you chopped off your child's foot.
You: Are there any other allegations?
CW: No.
You: Here's my child's foot, as you can see it firmly attached to his foot.

Eljay, as always, your advice is excellent. This part made me laugh. I especially love the part about speaking slowly so you can write it down in case the recording fails.

[Eljay]

You (on your front porch): What is the allegation? Please speak slowly, I'm going to write this down in case my video recording fails.
CW: We received report that you chopped off your child's foot.
You: Are there any other allegations?
CW: No.
You: Here's my child's foot, as you can see it firmly attached to his foot.

Eljay, as always, your advice is excellent. This part made me laugh. I especially love the part about speaking slowly so you can write it down in case the recording fails.

Thank you, but now that you made me re-read my post, I meant to say his foot was firmly attached to his LEG! Anatomy... not my strong suit!