Lost two would like to save the last one.

For those concerned about children and parents in CPS cases.

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Sarandipity
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:37 pm

Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby Sarandipity » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:45 am

Hello, to everyone in the group. I am writing you in hopes of getting some information that may help me and my step-daughter. My step-daughter is 35 weeks pregnant. She just signed her rights away a week ago to her two boys that have been in state custody for two years. She was told that she could go to trial but she would lose and then she would not get anything from the adoptive parents. She was told that she would receive a letter once a year letting her know how the boys were doing, but the adoptive parents would not agree to anything else. Her main motivation is to be done with the case before she gave birth because she didn't think they could take the baby if she gave up her rights even though she didn't want to let the boys go, but she did want to do the right thing. This has been very difficult for all of us, but the boy’s mom and dad did very little and now have to deal with the consequences.

So now she will be giving birth in about 4 to 5 weeks. My step-daughter has burnt many of her bridges and just recently got in trouble with the law as well as the father of the baby got in trouble with the law and is in jail. My step-daughter will be going into jail about two week after having the baby. We have decided to have the baby in the state next to where we are at right now. We are also having a Temporary Parental Consent Agreement as well as Temporary Guardianship and power of attorney all signed and notarized. Some may think this is over board but i really fear that this will not be enough to keep Cps away from the baby. Her lawyer that was assigned to her for the boys told her that it was just about impossible to stop CPS from coming after her baby in less she ran somewhere else. I could not believe that she said this based on the fact that she knows that she is in trouble with the law. I then restated what she said and asked if she was saying that my step-daughter should run even though she is already in a lot of trouble and that they would probably look for her because of all the charges she has. She stated that she could not encourage her to leave before she settled her issues with the law first. I really need to figure out the best thing to do. We have been told not to use state services because this allows them to continue tracking my daughter and they also said that even if we were able to move to a different state CPS would still be able to find her and the baby if she uses state assistance.

So I own my home here in WA, and might be able to move to another state; however this is something that will take some time. We have discussed what other choices there are such as third party custody. The ultimate goal is to protect the baby and make sure she grows up in a save and loving home. It is also important for my grand-baby's parents to follow through with parenting classes and drug treatment as well as finding jobs, they also have to stay out of trouble and follow the rules as well as a place to live so that they can build their family. My biggest concern is that even if we do all three of the above documents that it won’t be good enough in less we go through with the custody of the baby. My daughter has had her whole family turn their back on her and yes she has made some bad mistakes that she should never have gotten herself into.

My question is what does everyone think would be the best way to handle this situation? My step-daughter knows that she has made some huge mistakes and is afraid that she might make the wrong choice again, but she wants to prove that she can be a good mother and she thinks that the dad could step up to the plate as well, but she wants to do what will be the best solution without letting CPS get a hold of her. We would be very thankful for any information and recommendation you suggest.

Thank You
Sarandipity

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Eljay
Posts: 2645
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:01 am

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby Eljay » Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:17 am

Well... in theory, since she *voluntarily* gave up custody of the two boys, CPS should have NO legal standing for automatically taking subsequent children. However, they often do... brand new babies are SOOOOO easy to adopt out and it means $$$$$$$ for them. If/when they hear about the newborn, especially if in the hospital, they will rush in and try to take custody, but they won't have a legal cause for that. After all, if the baby is in the hospital/nursery, then clearly she's not in imminent danger. Yes, they HAVE done this before, which is absurd.... if memory serves, there was a woman who was an anti-vaccination mom and was ... well, here's the story: http://hslda.org/hs/state/pa/201203270.asp

Okay, so not quite the same, but it happens that CPS will take the babies right from the hospital when parent(s) have a history with CPS. So, you don't want that to happen. Consider a midwife/birthing center/homebirth if mother is otherwise healthy (hospitals are for sick people and pregnancy is not an illness!).

Temporary guardianship papers are an okay start, but won't prevent CPS from taking the baby. You need to have CUSTODY papers drawn and filed with court the second the baby is named. If she's going to jail the state WILL take legal custody from her.... but they can't take legal custody from someone like you, who has no history with CPS and the child was never abused/neglected by mom. Tell step-daughter that you can *always* give custody back when the time is right, but if CPS steps in and takes custody first, you'll probably never see that baby again.
Advice & opinions provided are no substitute for genuine legal assistance. Laws & rules vary by state/jurisdiction so do your homework and get
an education in CPS laws, rules & practices so that you can FIGHT for your children's rights. I am not a lawyer. Your mileage may vary.

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Sarandipity
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:37 pm

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby Sarandipity » Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:39 pm

Thank you for your time Eljay. You basically told me what I thought, but I wanted to make sure we made the best choice for everyone involved, especially the baby. I had not thought about a midwife, but what is your thought about going to a hospital in a different state and the use of state assistance?

Thank You
Sarandipity

User avatar
Eljay
Posts: 2645
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:01 am

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby Eljay » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:29 pm

Sarandipity wrote:Thank you for your time Eljay. You basically told me what I thought, but I wanted to make sure we made the best choice for everyone involved, especially the baby. I had not thought about a midwife, but what is your thought about going to a hospital in a different state and the use of state assistance?

Thank You
Sarandipity


Well.... I wish I knew more about just how the CPS spies work (namely, the "social workers" in the hospital). There are assumptions we all make, for example, as a normal part of your daughter's medical history, she will have indicated this is her third pregnancy/live birth. Someone may ask about her other two kids "boys or girls? who is watching them?" and if the answer is suspect (i.e. in foster care, er... with their dad... whatever) then that will trigger them to scan their little social worker database. *OR* perhaps her name has been flagged in the whole social services big brother database and because she's on state assistance, it pops up anyhow. States normally work just on their own state, and they only have jurisdiction within their states, but if they suspect your plan, they may be communicating with all local hospitals, even over state lines. In a situation where you had a genuinely dangerous mother out there, and CPS had every right to take subsequent children, you would have to assume that they have the procedures in place for all concerned parties to be on notice. Could they abuse those procedures in the unlawful acquisition of newborns? Absolutely.

Regardless, she should try and get out of the hospital ASAP (my cousin was out 4 hours after having natural birth). I had my daughter at 7:45 at night so it was not good timing to get out really fast, but when the nurse came in at 8 a.m the next morning and asked when I'd like to leave, I said, "right now!" It did take them a few hours to finish up paperwork, but I was out by noon. Tell her no epidural, no pain meds.... if she doesn't want to risk losing this baby, she's got to get in and out... just say "I don't like hospitals."

How does she get state assistance in another state if she's not a resident?
Advice & opinions provided are no substitute for genuine legal assistance. Laws & rules vary by state/jurisdiction so do your homework and get
an education in CPS laws, rules & practices so that you can FIGHT for your children's rights. I am not a lawyer. Your mileage may vary.

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family_man
Posts: 1138
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:02 am
Location: TX

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby family_man » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:36 pm

I think your precautions are sensible, could be effective, but are not guaranteed to work. I would say the temporary guardianship agreement is the least you can do. Having the baby out of state will also help, as long as that hospital doesn't know your daughter has permanent residency elsewhere.

The thing is, while your daughter serves her time in prison/jail, the baby has to go somewhere. The authorities will know about the baby and will ask where she is. The case will likely be referred to CPS in your state. Expect an investigation, and follow all the normal precautions. Keep your home as clean and neat as possible. Don't let them in without making an appointment first. Don't sign any release documents or service plans unless they take it to court. Hire an attorney on a standby basis if the case escalates. Don't volunteer unnecessary information. Show them the temporary custody agreement, and check with your lawyer to make sure that it abides with your state's laws.

In the best case, you can give the baby back to your daughter after she serves her time. If push comes to shove with CPS, your daughter might consider voluntarily relinquishing her parental rights to you, so that you could adopt. Another alternative is permanent guardianship, which does not require a TPR.
Disclaimer: I am not an attorney, and this is not legal advice.

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Eljay
Posts: 2645
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:01 am

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby Eljay » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:41 pm

family_man wrote: Expect an investigation, and follow all the normal precautions.


Very true. If you want them to leave you alone, tell them you have no intention of letting mother ever have the baby and they'll think you're on their side. :)
Advice & opinions provided are no substitute for genuine legal assistance. Laws & rules vary by state/jurisdiction so do your homework and get
an education in CPS laws, rules & practices so that you can FIGHT for your children's rights. I am not a lawyer. Your mileage may vary.

----<>----<>----<>---- BREED WITH CAUTION ----<>----<>----<>----

Sarandipity
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:37 pm

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby Sarandipity » Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:35 pm

Eljay,


Eljay wrote: How does she get state assistance in another state if she's not a resident?



She would not have state assistance in the state she would have the baby in. She only has insurance in the state she currently is staying in and she applied as homeless, however she came here from the other side of the United States where she had food and insurance from the state she was in and she applied as homeless there as well.

Sarandipity

HeidiMercer
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:21 pm

Re: Lost two would like to save the last one.

Postby HeidiMercer » Mon Nov 05, 2012 6:24 pm

Hope everything has worked out for you. CPS just tears up families.


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